Ep 147: Creating Winning YouTube Ads That 3X Your Results with Will Palmer

How would you like to 3x your digital marketing results? Hey, this is Jaryd Krause, host of the Buying Online Businesses Podcast. And in this episode, I'm speaking with Will Palmer from Tier 11, who has spent north of $10 million in Facebook ads and is now focused on transitioning people to YouTube ads. In this podcast episode, Will and I talk about how to migrate from Facebook advertising over to YouTube advertising. And why? Why it's critical and why it's important to be on YouTube as well, not just in terms of a diverse method, but also because of the changes that are happening within the Facebook algorithm—you know, all the accounts getting shut down on iOS and all these other things.

We talk about that in depth. We also talk about YouTube ad targeting, who we can actually target with our YouTube ads, why we should be targeting different people with our YouTube chat YouTube ads and how to make that targeting happen and produce results. We also talk about the ad creative itself and why the creative and the creation of the ad are so important. And how to make different ad creatives and test out those different creatives according to your business and what you're trying to promote. We also talk about what your ads should include. So the little things that should be in your ad that can prompt people to take action, prompt you to get results with your ads, and prompt you to build a connection and relationship with people that are watching your ads so different things that you need to have within your ads to get that result is what we talk about.

We also talk about the different types of offers your ads should be offering, the different types of things that you can promote for different audiences that are in different parts of their buying journey, which can allow you to get great results. We also talk about different remarketing options within YouTube, how you can have remarketing lists, and how you can build up those lists. We also talk about how YouTube provides better quality leads, can increase your customer lifetime value, and so much more. I'm really excited about this podcast episode.

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Will, thank you so much for coming on the show. Yeah, it's a pleasure to be here. Happy to be here. Man, it's been a conversation I've wanted to have with you for so long. We chatted probably three months ago. And we'd be chatting via email. And I'm on YouTube, and I'm excited by YouTube. A big reason is that Facebook hates me. Like so many businesses these days. Yeah. Right? to make money online.

And even if you aren't doing anything particularly wrong, there are a lot of people in other niches as well. So I kind of wanted to jump on and you know, you've been working with TierTier, and you've been working to get people migrated from Facebook onto YouTube in a sense, right? You started with Facebook. Tell me about YouTube.

Why is that a thing? So, yes. The reason why so many clients have an interest in YouTube, I think, is because, well, number one, it's owned by Google, and Google basically owns the whole internet. And then, number two, it's actually the second biggest search engine after Google itself. So, you know, if often somebody has a problem or they're looking to find out how to do something, they'll go to YouTube just because people like to see videos.

You are too lazy to read. And it's good to get explanations, obviously, from an actual person. So yeah, there's a lot of search intent on YouTube. And the other thing is that it's video based. So for a lot of those, if you've had success on Facebook, it's more than likely you've had success with video advertising. So if you have some good videos, they can easily be adapted, and that's where we can start testing on YouTube. Yeah, cool.

So Facebook has started to get quite tricky with all the changes that are happening. And it's not just Facebook itself with their algorithm; it's also outside forces like iOS changes and all that sort of stuff. Is that a big force that has pushed you towards YouTube ads as well? Or is there anything else?

So, are clients just saying, Oh, we're not getting results on Facebook like we were? What are some of the things that have sort of made them want to move from Facebook and test out or experiment with YouTube? Yeah, definitely. Like what's happened over the last year, 2020 has been a very tough year for small businesses advertising on Facebook. And I think, yeah, what happened with the iOS 14 update.

That's been a big push to kind of force people to diversify their channels. I think people probably got a little bit too comfortable with Facebook—maybe a little bit lazy. You know, they were getting really good results on Facebook, so they were happy just plowing away on Facebook. But, you know, it's never a healthy place to be when you're over-alliant on one channel, because, like you said yourself, Facebook doesn't like you. Like the same, like they don't like many businesses.

Open up your account one day and you've been completely banned for no apparent reason or for some reason—sometimes it can be for a sexual thing and your business is selling pet products, you know, you can just get flagged for completely random policy violations, and then their support is obviously really bad. So yeah, it's just a healthy thing for a business to be diversified across different platforms and drive traffic from a number of different sources, and I think Facebook, Google, YouTube, and Google are kind of the same thing anyway, but we really do look at search and YouTube as like two separate channels, so they're the big ones Google search, YouTube, Facebook, maybe some Google display as well, and then more often now people are starting to like adapt, TikTok is huge at the moment; Snapchat; and then depending on the business, you could do a little bit of Pinterest.

Smaller channels like that, but yeah, I think if you're big enough, it's just a healthy thing to be diversified across all of your channels.

Yeah, I'm definitely seeing a lot more people on YouTube. You know, even not just with my business seeing more and more people, you know, watching YouTube videos, but even when I speak to people, you know, when they consume content, spending less time on Facebook and more time on YouTube, when I'm out there speaking to somebody, they're like, yeah, I'm always watching this YouTube channel or, you know, watching this.

And it's just, you can see that people prefer to consume their content via video and audio. And that's me as well. Personally, I prefer that to reading, um, or scrolling on Facebook. So how does one, this Facebook is just a pit, Just a pit of a time pit, really. So, yeah, how does one start to go? All right. What do I, you know, need to get?

In order to start migrating and start doing some YouTube stuff. Do you help people with organic YouTube, or is it just, if you're running these ads on Facebook, let's get those similar types of ads on YouTube. How do you help people make this migration or add it as another channel, diversification? Yeah, there are a couple of different ways we can go about it.

More recently, I'm starting to look into more of the organic side and I am starting to do some consulting and helping clients with their organic channels as well. We have to grow that, and there are also ways that we can kind of use ads to help grow that organic side as well. So it's not fully organic, but it just gives a little boost with something called discovery ads. But yeah, like, how do we get a client who's been led primarily on Facebook to switch to YouTube?

Like the first big thing that we look at, Facebook is primarily interruption marketing. So, you know, people are saying, like you said, it's a waste of time. You just go on there to waste time, you're scrolling through, and then you will get interrupted by an ad. And if the ad is good enough, you'll click through to the landing page, and so on. The way we look at YouTube is that it's much more intent based marketing. So people are going there to search for something. A lot of people go there just for entertainment. So they might go on with it.

They've got an hour to kill or they're on there looking at music videos, but the other 50% of people who visit YouTube are there with a much stronger intent. And that's that 50, roughly about 50% of people, they say, go there with intent. And they're the types of people that we really want to get in front of, especially in those early days, because, for example, let's say somebody is searching for how to buy a website or how to do due diligence on buying my first website.

And if you have an ad that speaks specifically to that keyword or to that phrase that somebody is searching for, you can match your targeting exactly to that keyword or to the placements that show up for that keyword. And if your ad calls that out, you have like super high relevancy, and because they're already looking for that type of information, if your ad is relevant, you know, they're going to be there, they're going to consume that ad because they're looking to take in as much information as they can about buying a website or whatever it is they're searching for.

So yeah, the first thing is looking for those types of assets and making sure that somebody has videos that speak to people. They're more or less educational ads. They're not kind of educated, what we call an ad is also educating.

Facebook, where sometimes you just have a gift or you're just putting the offer, the price, and some other things in front of people's faces for 30 seconds. YouTube, where you look at it much more like a video or television advertisement—almost closer to a television advertisement—and it is like a short video ad from Facebook or Instagram. Yeah, definitely. So there are a few different things that we need to Break down there that you've mentioned, one of which is that the intent is big and important.

I think that the difference between Facebook scrolling and liking is that when you put something out on Facebook, hopefully somebody sees it at the right time for them in their buying journey, right? Compared to somebody going to YouTube to solve a problem, I just need to fix this thing with my car or something like that, or I need to do a home improvement thing. How do I, you know, tile my bathroom?

They're trying to tile their bathroom. You know, if you're selling tiles on Facebook, not everybody is going to want to buy tiles and scroll to look at buying tiles, but somebody that's looking to, uh, you know, retail their bathroom, they're going to want, you know, they're probably most likely in the market for tiles as well, because they're learning how they can do it themselves. Right. So it's the CPA, and I can definitely see how it can become really good for YouTube when the intent is there.

Talking about the difference in video on Facebook and YouTube is very interesting. Typically, what's the difference between, you know, a TV based commercial and a YouTube ad? What are some of the things that you may need to have in the creative of a YouTube ad? And I guess we're probably talking about in stream ads here.

What are some of the things that need to be in the creative of that video compared to a Facebook video?

Yeah, so from my experience, the types of ads that work best are those where you actually have the face of the business or the spokesperson of the business, or even if you can't get that, just having somebody on camera is usually the type of ads that work best. And then, yeah, there are a number of different ads that we can create. We have basically a library of different ad formats that we would recommend for a client, depending on the type of business that they have, and the type of targeting that we're doing, whether it's going to be a cold audience or a retargeting audience.

But typically, for a cold audience, which is where 80%–90% of the spend usually goes, I like to follow a format called the educate format. So basically, it's just an easy way to get going and to get all of your assets in place. And just to get that first ad live, if they don't already have an asset that we can use from Facebook or from some other channel. But yeah, the education formula starts with the aim. So, like, what is the aim of the ad, or what has the person come to YouTube for? So that's typically what we will call out in the first five seconds of the ad. And then it goes into difficulty.

So like what is the consumer's difficulty, understanding, let them know that you understand their problem. And then you gain some credibility. So back it up with some customer testimonials or if you have any other types of credibility, like maybe you are featured in a magazine or some type of TV show, and then an action plan, which just easily goes into Okay, this is what you need to do steps one, two, and three. It just makes it really attainable for the prospect, and then you just teach them, so you just give it an educational feel and then end with an exit.

So you kind of give them a little tease before the call to action at the end. So yeah, that's kind of typically one of the first ones. Yeah, exactly. That's just one of the kinds of formulas that we use. But I often find that's a good one to start with because it has so many separate parts. And then, for example, sometimes you'll find, Okay, there's a really good credibility section rather than leading with the aim or the difficulty, so you can kind of chop and change those elements really easily, and it's simple to, Yeah, chop and change and just test different variations.

And so when you say The credibility part was really good, How do you know that that part of the video was really good? How do you know where to go? Oh, the audience likes that? Is there some metric that you can look at, or is there some way, or is it just you?

Well, after producing the video, that part was pretty strong. What do you do? How do you determine whether a part of the video is good or not? Yeah, no, for that example, it's usually if you, like, I have one client in mind who had some really strong testimonials, and it was basically their customers sitting down. The video looked really good, the quality was good, and they were basically just talking about how this product changed their lives. And you can just tell by watching it.

It actually emotionally moves you. And it's just like, We can't bury this lead. This is the best part of the ad. We need to move that to the start, lead with that, and let that be the hook. And it was like, Yeah, this product changed this person's life. And then from there, we kind of led into, like, building tension around the kind of individual, and yeah, how this can also change your life. So yeah, that was a little bit more.

It wasn't really based on data, but it was just a really good testimonial.

Yeah, I can see that you'd want to have a digital marketing head to be able to go. All right, this has hooked me emotionally. Where do we put this in different parts of the video, which may be harder for some people listening, but I guess they can go away and ask people, What part of the video do you like? or What part of the video grabbed you most? and then rearrange it that way. I want to come back to another piece of the puzzle that we haven't yet talked about.

And this could be my fault. We kind of just went straight into the creative here, which is critical, like you've said, for YouTube. Very different from Facebook. But how do we get people from searching for or being on YouTube to watching that video? How do we do it? Is there some way that we can target them? There's that. You know, what are the different targeting options in terms of when we do this on Facebook? We can target different audiences.

On YouTube, and what are some of the good tips that you have for us on that? Yeah, cool. We'll talk a bit about targeting, but I think it's even better that you started with the creative because that's the most important thing about YouTube advertising. On some of the other channels, like Facebook, you can maybe rely a little bit more on the copy because you have lots of space for copy, but on YouTube, it's solely the video. That's all you have. You have a tiny—I think it's 10 or 12 characters or something—but yeah, creatively, you're not going to succeed on YouTube. But yeah, targeting is also important, of course.

So there are a couple of places where I like to start, and usually I will start as specific as I can, go after those really low or really good CPAs, prove out the fact that YouTube is going to work for this business, and then from there we can scale out. So the most specific or most laser type of targeting that we can do is called video placement. So let's take your example from earlier. Let's say somebody is trying to find out how to tile their bathroom. So how do I tile my bathroom? You're selling tiling tools or tiles. How to tile my bathroom is the keyword, and then you can take the 50. There's a tool that I use called Adzoola. A-D-Z-O-O-L-A. Yeah, it's an awesome tool. I'd recommend it for anybody who's starting YouTube advertising, and basically, it can do a number of things, but one of the things it does is let you put in that keyword for how to tile my bathroom. That will give you the results that YouTube will have, so you can take either 50 or 500 results for that keyword and then plug those into a placement campaign on YouTube, and then your ad will only show on those specific placements.

So that's the most targeted, the most laser type of targeting that you can do. You can then go into your placements, analyze that campaign, say, Okay, this placement is not performing that well, let's pause that placement, and the budget gets redistributed to the other placement. So you just have, it's very targeted, but you also have a lot of control over the budget, and it's easy to pause placements. From there, you have keyword targeting.

Yeah, yeah. So I was just going to say, just for people listening, maybe they didn't get it. It's so basically other competitors that have videos About what you're talking about in your ad is you can put your ad on their videos basically, And I think people that are watching stuff on YouTube have seen this already, like if they're into Entrepreneurship or if they're in the make money space and they're watching a video on make money business opportunity or how to start your business will come up on that type of video, right?

Same with, say, if you're in a toilet bathroom and you're watching somebody else's video on how to tile a bathroom, you're basically targeting your competitor's audience, aren't you? Well, yeah, you can do it for competitors, or yeah, you can, or you can just do it for general keywords, which obviously often will have competitor videos in there. But yeah, it's a really good way to get super specific. And then, of course, you can do channel placement. So if you're in the how to make money online niche, you know there are certain channels like Grant Cardone or whoever else, Russell Brunson, and different people like that.

So you can show ads only on their channels, and you could have a campaign, and then you can start optimizing based on which channels are performing the best. Sometimes people can actually have the option to not monetize their YouTube channel, so certain businesses will have that option turned off. So you might think you have a really good channel to target, and they have millions of subscribers, but they might not be monetizing that channel, and you won't be able to show ads there. So that's the only instance where you won't be able to do that.

And then, yeah, from placement targeting, you can then do keyword targeting. So it's just a little bit broader, basically, if somebody types in How to make money online? You will show any video that they're watching on YouTube within that session, so a session is 40 minutes, So it's a little bit wider. They could be watching, you know, something completely unrelated to your product, business, or services. And then, from there, you go into topic targeting, which is really good. We're having a lot of success with that, actually, with a number of different clients at the moment.

And it's huge, just a huge scale there as well. And then there's audience targeting. You can create your own custom audiences, or lookalike audiences, or they're called similar audiences, but they're the same as lookalike audiences on Facebook, remarketing. Yeah, there are a lot of different targeting options you can use. I just want to pause this episode for an immediate update. Online business owners, please note that SEO and digital marketing are changing forever. 2022 will not be the same as 2021, so you can't miss the Buying and Building Online Businesses Summit.

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I wouldn't say pixel a Google tag on your site or on your different pages and then retarget them on YouTube with different ads. Is that right? Yeah, if you had enough traffic, you could retarget people based on URLs. So if somebody is visiting a very specific page on your website, you could follow up with a video that you know makes sense and leads off from that page that much website traffic it would be best just to do all website visitors and you follow up with a remarketing video you know maybe some objection busters or maybe some testimonials something basically that makes sense to somebody who has already seen your website or seen your offer so that's a good good type of targeting and another another low hanging fruit would be people who have interacted with your YouTube channel so if you already have a presence on YouTube you can basically target your subscribers, you can target anybody who is viewed any of your videos, anybody who's liked any of your videos.

And then, once you start doing some YouTube advertising, you can also retarget anybody who has viewed a video from an ad. It's another good thing to do. Cool. Cool. So basically, somebody's, I guess, somebody who's called from a keyword that's viewed an ad and they watch the whole thing, I guess you can put another ad in front of them on Facebook as well, right? Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, cool. So what, you know, when somebody's like, All right, I'm running my business on Facebook with Facebook ads, and they may be, you know, selling a product directly on Facebook through their ad or they're running a campaign to get leads and giving like a discount code or a free resource or some sort of opt-in?

Where would you typically start with your ads? What are you, and where would you typically start to promote? What would you typically start to promote in terms of offers? Because is it working just straight up, you know, here by my product? Or do you have to lead in with something a lot softer?

Yeah, no, not typically, like we will just take whatever offer they're running or whatever their best performing offer on Facebook is, we will take that, and then we will start on YouTube, and we will usually start with that more focused type of targeting like placements, keywords, prove out the concept there, and then from there we can start going out to some of the broader forms of targeting like topics, audience targeting, and then we'll also have that basis from Facebook.

So we know that this offer has such a conversion rate on Facebook. And you know, these are the metrics that we're getting from Facebook. So at least we can compare it to that. And we have a benchmark to work from. One of the other things we started to notice was a lot of clients who kind of had some more advanced tracking capabilities, like people who were using Wicked Reporting, Hyros, or anything like that for their customers.

Typically, YouTube and Google actually as well have a much higher lifetime value coming from YouTube and Google than Facebook. And that's really down to the purchase intent as well. People are searching for specific products, or solutions to specific problems. So you're getting a higher quality lead from Google and YouTube compared to Facebook, but oftentimes it's more of an impulse purchase or you have to be persuaded a lot more to become a buyer. Wow, so much better. You can get better. It's customary to get a lot of value from YouTube because of their intent. Yeah, yeah, one client in particular saw after one month, the value of leads that were coming to Facebook.

So that meant we could obviously shoot much higher. three times. Three times is valuable. So let's say that coming from Facebook, they were valued at like $100, and from YouTube, they were $300 after one month. So that basically meant we could increase our cost per acquisition on YouTube, which allowed for a much greater scale. But yeah, these are the types of things you have to keep an eye on because, often, It does cost more to acquire a customer on Facebook. or, sorry, on Google or YouTube. But you know, if they're three times more valuable, it all works out in the end.

Yeah, that's a really good mindset to have, right? It may cost you more to acquire a lead, but more of those leads could convert on YouTube than on Facebook. Let's give an example, so people understand this. So you get a hundred leads from Facebook that are $10 each, right? So that's $1,000. And then you get leads from YouTube that cost you a thousand dollars all up as well. Right? So from those 50 leads on YouTube compared to 100 leads on Facebook, you may have 10 people convert. Right? So you had a 10% conversion rate in terms of sales. And then, from those 50 leads on YouTube, you may get 20 percent or 20 people buying, which means you're getting a far higher conversion rate but paying more for the lease and getting a higher customer lifetime value. Does that math make sense? Yeah, it does, and it's a common thing that we do see as well, and if you think about it, it makes sense if somebody is already coming into your funnel with a higher purchase intent.

So if somebody is on YouTube and they're searching, how do I buy a business? Or what are the red flags I need to look for when I'm buying an online business? They're already almost sold. You know, rather than Facebook, people might see it and say, Okay, yeah, this is a really cool opportunity. Maybe I can make a quick book. They don't really know what they're getting into, but they still click on it just because there's so much volume there on Facebook. But yeah, often we see a much higher quality lead, and people convert at a higher rate, and then they will also buy more if that's the type of business that you have when they come from YouTube. Well, that's amazing, that's really cool.

I think that mindset for people who are running ads on Facebook or running ads anywhere is critical to understand because more is not always the best, right? It's like coming back to quality over quantity that plays out in so many different aspects that I just think people listening are probably sick of me talking about quality over quantity. Yeah, let's talk about the leads because Is there a certain Opt-in that works quite well that you've seen for people on YouTube compared to Facebook? You know, where would somebody start if they were going to create an ad and just go, I'm going to create an ad, and I'm going to create one that targets keywords or one that targets, you know, different videos?

And what should they be offering in that ad? In terms of, you know, the call to action, what should that be for somebody starting out, do you think, for their business? Yeah, for somebody starting out, I probably wouldn't go too granular and I wouldn't try to, keywords or placements at the start, I would just try and get like your best content out there and then from that then after your initial testing you can kind of drill down a little bit deeper and see okay look these keywords are performing really well let's make a video specifically for this keyword or okay these placements these five ten placements we've been getting all of our conversions from what is it about these placements and go in there and look at the videos that people are converting on and we'll try and match up that data and kind of drill down and see what it is about those and then possibly use that to make a video.

But at the start, I would just take your best content and get that out there and kind of go a little bit broader with your video, even if you're targeting it, you're still going for that super specific targeting, but it's also broad. So you're doing it across different keywords, and they're going to be keywords a bit broader on the video, and just try to make the best content you can. That's what I often do with that educational formula. I just find it a good one to start with if somebody doesn't have any assets that we can use from Facebook.

And yeah, or if you have another one, like, don't just talk about your business, talk about a problem, lead with a problem, agitate that problem, and then talk about the solution and how your business can be the solution. So don't make it too much like an ad. You have to kind of, you know, stick with the style of the platform. So they say as well, when you're making TikTok, don't make ads; make TikTok. When you're making YouTube video ads, you don't make them like YouTube videos. So don't just go straight in there and make it too salesy. I like it. That's a really good point because you make money online, Niche. It's so salesy.

Like the ad will do, we'll get them to the landing page. So at the end of the ad, I always put a countdown timer. So it just gives people an extra five seconds or so to actually click and, like, have an arrow pointing down, making it really obvious, like, click the link below to learn more. So yeah, just give them a little bit of time because often your ad can transition straight into whatever that video is that they actually came to YouTube for. So yeah. Yeah. Give them that little bit, and then the landing page will do the next step.

And yeah, typically, I've seen a lot of different offers work well on YouTube, whether it's e-commerce, lead magnets, or like $27 tripwires. Typically, those types of offers have performed best. And yeah, interestingly enough, often what works well is when you have a video on the landing page. So, you know.

So just a short video sales letter kind of explaining what your product or service is about. For some reason, that combination of video and audio just seems to work well. You know, it obviously has some kind of congruence. People are already after buying into the video and then yeah you can ask them after that for their lead or a tripwire offer whatever it may be. Cool. Okay. So lead for free things or trip wire for mini, mini products.

That's really cool, yeah. Well, this has been, and if you can test both, yeah.

So let's talk briefly about testing before we finish up. You mean test one landing page versus another landing page, or just test the different offers? Would you suggest what you should start testing? Would you start testing audiences first? Would you start testing creative first, or would you start testing offers first?

Yeah, you kind of have to test a couple of different things at the same time because you know you're going to have, hopefully, more than one ad, so you're going to be testing at least two ads at the same time. And then, yeah, obviously, not everybody is going to have a lot of budget, so yeah, I would recommend testing two to four ads with one landing page, preferably the lead landing page, lead magnet, first, just because it's going to be to get leads, see which ad performs best, see how cheap you can get your cost per lead, and then maybe from there, you can test your lead magnet funnel and then see how those names back out compared to the names that came from your lead magnet.

But yeah, there are countless different combinations that you can test. In an ideal world, you'd like to be testing the lead magnet and the tripwire, same time, and you could really analyze at the end of the month which one brought in more profit. And yeah, I would always have at least two ads live in every campaign, and I often have a separate campaign set up just for testing new ads, so when those best performing ads start to fatigue, you'll have something else to go in their place. Yeah, and I guess it's a lot easier to measure one ad that's live against another ad that's live rather than having to go backwards and forwards to see, Oh, what was that other ad that we had on again to test it against it? All right, awesome. Will, thank you so much for coming on. Where can we send people if they want to rack your brain, work with you, or learn more from you? Yeah, I'd love to hear from some of your audience, and probably the best place they can find me now is LinkedIn. So if they just search Will Palmer, PLM, you're on LinkedIn. I'd be happy to chat. Awesome. Cool.

All right. Well, I'll put your link to LinkedIn in the show notes, guys. Check that out there. Those of you who are listening, thank you so much for listening. If you know somebody who has a business that's running ads on Facebook or isn't running ads at all and may be considering YouTube, please make sure you share this podcast episode with them so they can learn this process from start to finish, on how and what they should be doing to create an ad that actually converts.

Thanks for listening, guys. See you.